Stadium Expansion

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Re: Stadium Expansion

Postby eastbarnetsupporter » 01 Jun 2018, 12:06

pgbee wrote:Having a long narrow terrace with a high back wall along the side of the pitch is rubbish. I suspect most South standers would not go there, which is of course the point , to remove the low paying end of the fan base by making the facilities to stand the worst they could be. Save by only doing half the length as there won't be enough standers to fill even that.



I think many would welcome a similar 'underhill east stand' scenario at the hive. Standing on the south is difficult viewing wise, the view is pretty poor.

I'd definitely relocate to the east if it was to become a standing.

People complaining about the sun.. we barely get sun in this country, we'll be alright lol
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Re: Stadium Expansion

Postby becbee » 01 Jun 2018, 14:04

Agewills wrote:"As well as the likely increase in number of visitors to the ground..."

That made me laugh!

I can see the number of visitors to the ground changing...but not increasing!


The masses coming from Barrow?
Presumably Gateshead might bring more than 15 next visit!
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Re: Stadium Expansion

Postby Hiveoccupier » 01 Jun 2018, 14:42

pgbee wrote:Having a long narrow terrace with a high back wall along the side of the pitch is rubbish. I suspect most South standers would not go there, which is of course the point , to remove the low paying end of the fan base by making the facilities to stand the worst they could be. Save by only doing half the length as there won't be enough standers to fill even that.


I don't think that's the point at all. TK could just develop the stadium as an all seater venue and have done with it. Her could go for rail and seating dual use stand to replace the current South stand but that would come at a totally unwarranted cost. Having a standing terrace on the East and a similar stand to the North and the South end of the ground is a good compromise. I will definitely be using the East Terrace when it is available.

As for the argument about the size of the stadium, I suspect that the size of Barnet FCs crowds is a red herring - it is and always intended to be a stadium used by multiple clubs and it would be easy to see it eventually hosting a Premier League RFU club who could fill most of it most of the time. In a strange twist to a long saga it could be that at a future date the sale of Underhill could be funding the construction of the home stadium of a Rugby club who go on to be arch local rivals to Saracens.
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Re: Stadium Expansion

Postby simples169 » 01 Jun 2018, 15:00

Its all very well improving the stadium and facilities but should not the same attention be being afforded to having a first team that can win games, gain promotions and offer something supporters can enjoy?
Success breeds success so with a successful team there would be a need that everyone can see that all these upgrades are required.It just seems that the first team is not the priority but a building is.
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Re: Stadium Expansion

Postby Norfolk & Chance » 01 Jun 2018, 17:58

Hiveoccupier wrote:
pgbee wrote:Having a long narrow terrace with a high back wall along the side of the pitch is rubbish. I suspect most South standers would not go there, which is of course the point , to remove the low paying end of the fan base by making the facilities to stand the worst they could be. Save by only doing half the length as there won't be enough standers to fill even that.


I don't think that's the point at all. TK could just develop the stadium as an all seater venue and have done with it. Her could go for rail and seating dual use stand to replace the current South stand but that would come at a totally unwarranted cost. Having a standing terrace on the East and a similar stand to the North and the South end of the ground is a good compromise. I will definitely be using the East Terrace when it is available.

As for the argument about the size of the stadium, I suspect that the size of Barnet FCs crowds is a red herring - it is and always intended to be a stadium used by multiple clubs and it would be easy to see it eventually hosting a Premier League RFU club who could fill most of it most of the time. In a strange twist to a long saga it could be that at a future date the sale of Underhill could be funding the construction of the home stadium of a Rugby club who go on to be arch local rivals to Saracens.



I thought it was supposed to be temporary?

So if you are right Hive, then anyone thinking our stadium plans are for Barnet FC to sweep all before them and establish ourselves in the Championship is deluded beyond description.
If you are right, this plan could well be the chairman's exit plan with an RFU club as the main purpose and little old non league Barnet FC as a sideshow.
I hope you're wrong, as personally, all I'm interested in is Barnet FC.
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Re: Stadium Expansion

Postby shankbee01 » 01 Jun 2018, 18:07

I don’t think there’s any money to be made in Southern RL.


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Re: Stadium Expansion

Postby BeesKnees » 01 Jun 2018, 18:22

I'm not convinced rugby is an option. If that was his plan then the pitch would need to be bigger.
Expect to see plenty of second tier international games.
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Re: Stadium Expansion

Postby Mikel Bee » 01 Jun 2018, 19:00

Norfolk & Chance wrote:
Hiveoccupier wrote:
pgbee wrote:Having a long narrow terrace with a high back wall along the side of the pitch is rubbish. I suspect most South standers would not go there, which is of course the point , to remove the low paying end of the fan base by making the facilities to stand the worst they could be. Save by only doing half the length as there won't be enough standers to fill even that.


I don't think that's the point at all. TK could just develop the stadium as an all seater venue and have done with it. Her could go for rail and seating dual use stand to replace the current South stand but that would come at a totally unwarranted cost. Having a standing terrace on the East and a similar stand to the North and the South end of the ground is a good compromise. I will definitely be using the East Terrace when it is available.

As for the argument about the size of the stadium, I suspect that the size of Barnet FCs crowds is a red herring - it is and always intended to be a stadium used by multiple clubs and it would be easy to see it eventually hosting a Premier League RFU club who could fill most of it most of the time. In a strange twist to a long saga it could be that at a future date the sale of Underhill could be funding the construction of the home stadium of a Rugby club who go on to be arch local rivals to Saracens.



I thought it was supposed to be temporary?

So if you are right Hive, then anyone thinking our stadium plans are for Barnet FC to sweep all before them and establish ourselves in the Championship is deluded beyond description.
If you are right, this plan could well be the chairman's exit plan with an RFU club as the main purpose and little old non league Barnet FC as a sideshow.
I hope you're wrong, as personally, all I'm interested in is Barnet FC.


Why the paranoia? I struggle to see how sharing facilities with another sports club leads to us remaining non league. The more use the place gets, the more money can be put towards the first team squad. The Hive's non BFC income is what subsidised our tiny crowds with a top 10 league 2 budget.
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Re: Stadium Expansion

Postby ninestein » 01 Jun 2018, 19:18

There's no reason why the Hive cannot be a realistic venue for some international games at U19 and U17 level. It's already been tested to a certain extent with Nigeria playing there.
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Re: Stadium Expansion

Postby BeesKnees » 08 Jun 2018, 07:21

I've just been looking at the plans that are on the clubs website. I assumed the south stand would be identical to the north but its not, there appear to be 11 executive boxes along the back of the stand.
There is also no sign of a roof for the east terrace, which is a pity.
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Re: Stadium Expansion

Postby ninestein » 08 Jun 2018, 07:49

The South Stand will have "mixed use space" over three floors at the rear part overlooking the car park.
The existing North Stand will have the indoor sports hall built at the rear, so once completed, both stands will probably look pretty similar in terms of bulk. From the inside of the stadium, from what I can make out, It looks like both end stands will be identical.

The interesting thing is the rear of the West Stand. The club already has planning permission for an extension to the rear of that stand, which would be built over the tarmac gangway and Legends bar entrance. I'm guessing that might have had something to do with the block D saga and providing banqueting for matchday guests, but seeing as that plan has been shelved, I wonder whether that extension will actually happen?

Also, if the East side is being converted back to a terrace, what are TK's plans to relocate matchday guests, press and club officials who currently sit around the dugout?
Last edited by ninestein on 08 Jun 2018, 07:53, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Stadium Expansion

Postby hoofer2 » 08 Jun 2018, 07:52

BeesKnees wrote:I've just been looking at the plans that are on the clubs website. I assumed the south stand would be identical to the north but its not, there appear to be 11 executive boxes along the back of the stand.
There is also no sign of a roof for the east terrace, which is a pity.


I thought the same about the East Stand roof at first, however it's clear to me that the redevelopments planned are going to be the enablers for improvements to East Stand.
Once built and up and running and available commercially, some of the activities in East Stand could potentially be relocated, then longer term plans for the East Terrace can resume.
I believe TK's intentions are eventually for a second tier etc.

Until a more extensive makeover has been planned - e.g. the roof profiles to match other terraces, I guess it is not worth investing in a temporary fix.

You cannot knock the efforts by TK and I hope John Still / Darren Currie will help to improve things on the pitch too so we can continue on an upward trajectory.

Out of interest, do we still have the cap on maximum ground attendance? And has the 10 year restriction on League football been waived now?
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Re: Stadium Expansion

Postby BeesKnees » 08 Jun 2018, 08:44

ninestein wrote:The South Stand will have "mixed use space" over three floors at the rear part overlooking the car park.
The existing North Stand will have the indoor sports hall built at the rear, so once completed, both stands will probably look pretty similar in terms of bulk. From the inside of the stadium, from what I can make out, It looks like both end stands will be identical.

The interesting thing is the rear of the West Stand. The club already has planning permission for an extension to the rear of that stand, which would be built over the tarmac gangway and Legends bar entrance. I'm guessing that might have had something to do with the block D saga and providing banqueting for matchday guests, but seeing as that plan has been shelved, I wonder whether that extension will actually happen?

Also, if the East side is being converted back to a terrace, what are TK's plans to relocate matchday guests, press and club officials who currently sit around the dugout?


I think it's clear in the plans that while the north and south stands when viewed from the pitch will be the same size, the profiles are different. The North stand seating goes all the way to the back but the south stand has a far larger area at the back.
southstand.JPG


I think the rear extension of the west stand will do the same, creating directors and press boxes on the top floor.
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Re: Stadium Expansion

Postby BeesKnees » 08 Jun 2018, 08:47

hoofer2 wrote:Out of interest, do we still have the cap on maximum ground attendance? And has the 10 year restriction on League football been waived now?


The restriction was in the lease. As TK has now bought the freehold, I assume it's no longer an issue.
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Re: Stadium Expansion

Postby Mikel Bee » 08 Jun 2018, 08:55

hoofer2 wrote:Out of interest, do we still have the cap on maximum ground attendance? And has the 10 year restriction on League football been waived now?


It's now 8500 and TK bought the freehold a year or two back so the 10 year restriction no longer applies.

Good point about hospitality. Without the West extension, VIP guests will be standing on the East, behind the goal in the South or squeezing into Legends at half time, so perhaps the club are going to go ahead with extending the West but they must be getting near the 3 year limit since that application passed?

I'm sure the money has been invested in the right places for the long term future of the club and THL and I applaud TK for pushing the club's facilities forward but I can't help being distracted by the eye watering sums. Of the £60m overall spend on the Hive, £15m has been covered by the sale of Underhill. Are the rest loans? Grants? TK's pockets? Toshiba? Any of our accountants on here able to tell us how much debt we've repaid since acquiring PEPF?
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